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MWagner_MA
MWagner_MA
5/22/2019 9:00:01 AM
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Teacher
Re: L-1011 AOA Sensor
While not an expert in reliability engineering, I have had some training in it as you most likely have had.  My real fear is that the focus on software systems is overshadowing and minimizing the effort required to produce hardware that is reliable and up to the task of being mission critical capable.  How could an FMECA been allowed to pass muster with a single sensor!  Anyone with ANY training in FMECA/FMEA analysis would have stopped that project in its track.

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steve.taranovich
steve.taranovich
5/21/2019 7:07:32 PM
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Blogger
Re: L-1011 AOA Sensor
@BillWM---you are correct--I say "Always follow the money!"----Boeing made the second sensor optional and the airlines had to pay more for it! I believe that having two different sensors would be even more reliable, but I am not completely sure about that.

Maybe we could get some Reliability people to chime in on that

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BillWM
BillWM
5/21/2019 5:33:09 PM
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Re: L-1011 AOA Sensor
There are dozens of different AOA sensor designs used on different aircraft -- my thinking is with two pairs of two different sensors one would not have all affected in an incident

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steve.taranovich
steve.taranovich
5/21/2019 5:00:53 PM
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Blogger
Re: L-1011 AOA Sensor
@BillWM----That L-1011 sensor looks to be much better protected against 'bird strikes' and possible taxi damage during arrival and departure at the gate

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BillWM
BillWM
5/21/2019 3:57:26 PM
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Blogger
Re: Maybe what would be best is redundant dissimilar AOA sensing methods for each sensor
The real issue is in the air transport industry most of the prime and sub contractors have been "leaned out to the point of detonation" and the corporate budgets for R&D reduced -- This is one of those things that would save airlines money in insurance costs over time, but is hard to come up with an FAA grant to a corp, or even university, where in the UK there is about 8 million pounds annually for companies and universites for things like this and similar in the EU.

 

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steve.taranovich
steve.taranovich
5/21/2019 3:49:10 PM
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Blogger
Re: Maybe what would be best is redundant dissimilar AOA sensing methods for each sensor
@BillWM---Nowadays, due to budget constraints, NASA is working with private contractors like SpaceX, Blue Origin, and more. Why can't the FAA work with private contractors for something like this?

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BillWM
BillWM
5/21/2019 3:44:05 PM
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Blogger
Re: Maybe what would be best is redundant dissimilar AOA sensing methods for each sensor
The one issue with the MEMS sensor that comes to mind is for a wing like an airliner wing with all the lift augmentation surfaces deployed in the high lift mode the required acuracy for the AOA sensor aproaches 0.1 Deg or less.   A smaller lighter plane/UAV appearantly does not require the accuracy (65kts takeoff speed vs 170kts takeoff speed)  -- still seems worth researching but there is not much in the NASA / FAA budgets for aerospace R&D

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steve.taranovich
steve.taranovich
5/19/2019 4:10:57 PM
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Blogger
Re: Maybe what would be best is redundant dissimilar AOA sensing methods for each sensor
@BillWM----Interesting---I will look into this when I get a chance

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BillWM
BillWM
5/19/2019 2:56:21 PM
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Maybe what would be best is redundant dissimilar AOA sensing methods for each sensor
Did some checking and these sensors and the airspeed sensors in the last 20 years are linked to an Airbus A300 incident off of Brazil, an A320 series Aircraft In Europe and the two 737MAX losses.   Seems worth researching -- The FAA/CAA/NTSB human factors analysis that these are recoverable faults must be missing something ---

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